The Power of Professional Communities in the Era of AI

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We are talking about the power of communities, solving problems with communities, and how to do that in the era of AI, and we have a great guest to talk to us about this today, with a lot of experience in this area Matt Genovese.

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Welcome to the show.

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Thank you so much, eric, nice to meet you.

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Why don't we start off by you giving us, just a minute or two, a little bit about who you are and what you do?

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Sure.

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So my background is actually a bit varied.

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I think, if I were to look at my career, I didn't necessarily expect it was going to bob and weave as it did, but there's probably a lot of people in that same boat.

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Lot of people in that same boat.

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My background I have an undergrad and graduate in computer and electrical engineering and I spent about half my career as a chip designer in Austin, texas, and then I spent the other half of my career moving into software, product development and just mainly product development as a whole, and these days I run a product design firm called Planarama Design and we focus on the design and requirements and documentation that is needed for complex products, usually SaaS offerings, b2b offerings and things like that.

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We tend to get into the weeds and think about the nuances and challenges that commonly occur, that the development team that is downstream usually the client brings their own dev team is able to build it and build it efficiently and effectively and not stumble, and in fact, able to execute very quickly so we can get that product to market.

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As it turns out, I'm not a designer, I'm not a UX designer or anybody like that.

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I'm actually, as I said, an engineer, but I have a designer.

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I'm not a UX designer or anybody like that, I'm actually, as I said, an engineer but I have a great team of designers and I learn a lot from them and I think they learn some from me too, and together we are work done.

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But, like I said, I have a varied background and back when I was living in Austin, I actually started a technology community a bit by accident.

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It ended up growing quite big and I learned a lot from that experience and probably learned that I had some marketing chops when I didn't even realize I did.

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You never know what muscles you have until you got to use them.

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Indeed, so we're ready to be inspired.

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Let's hear a little bit about this.

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How did you build this community and what were you able to achieve with doing that?

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Well, the storyline is that I had went back to school after about seven years after getting my undergrad and I was working at Motorola at the time and I was able to go back and get my master's in electrical and computer engineering at the University of Texas at Austin, and I had met many people like myself, people that were in, you know, were maybe five to 10 years out of their undergrad, people that were working at companies, either at Motorola or at AMD or Intel or any other.

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You know many other tech companies in the Austin area If you know Austin.

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Austin has got so many tech companies.

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You know it's hard to find somebody who isn't working in tech sometimes, but I found it and I thought what a shame.

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Right, because engineers especially can benefit from networking and yet they often are seen as the more reclusive kind that aren't going out and expanding their network, aren't going out and expanding their network.

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It's not usually taught in school how to go do that, unless a professor happens to be forward thinking and trying to enlighten their class about how things work in the real world beyond designing chips or writing software.

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And so I thought it'd be really nice to find a way to kind of coalesce or aggregate all the tech people in the Austin area I was thinking of engineers and try to help them to meet each other, just to network, just to get together and have some interactions face-to-face.

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And this was around the time when LinkedIn was just coming out and networking was certainly being promoted and everybody was joining LinkedIn.

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In fact, I was trying to incentivize my own colleagues at work at Motorola.

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I said, boy, it'd be really good to join LinkedIn.

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There's real benefit to it.

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But at the same time I felt that there was a need to actually meet each other face-to-face, because there's a connection that you make with somebody, like I did in my master's program.

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You can't just make you know through a digital connection if you never have any interaction beyond.

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You know, subscribing or connecting or linking or whatever the term is right.

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You need to have a way to be able to get to know each other and have some kind of human to human connection, have some kind of human to human connection.

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And so, yeah, that was how I got started and it kind of grew from there.

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But in the end the result was we ended up over about six years having around 30,000 people become part of the community and lots of live events and things like that, and I learned a lot along the way.

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And that's where I kind of figured out that, oh, I can do this.

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I didn't know I could.

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And what was the real impact of creating this community of 30,000 people?

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Well, it's interesting, there are a couple of them right.

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One of them was people found jobs, right and I would have.

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I would go out sometimes and somebody would recognize me and say, oh, you're Matt from the community was called Door 64.

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I named it after my Commodore 64 that I had when I was growing up and but D-O-O-R like a door.

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And that was a temporary name until people, until I actually realized I couldn't change it anymore because everybody kind of gravitated to the name.

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But the tangible benefits was that people found work and it made legitimate changes in people's lives and I was really thrilled to see that.

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To know that something I started had that personal impact was incredibly rewarding and it just made my day anytime.

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Somebody told me that, or my week for that matter, and for me personally.

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I grew up in upstate New York in the 80s and there was a real downturn and my father was out of work for a long, long time.

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It had a lot of impact on our family.

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So there was a part of me that realized much, much later after I exited from door 64, after that point I realized that I was doing this to try to save, I think, a lot of families from the stress that happened.

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The primary caregiver or the primary breadwinner is out of work and that causes a lot of real stress and anxiety and changes people.

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So I was thrilled that we could accomplish that in and of itself, but we also found that there were ways to solve problems collectively that no one person could do themselves, and that was rather exciting.

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Yeah, and here in the era of AI, a lot of people, anytime they have a question, pops to their head they need advice.

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They think the main thing is to ask ChatGPT.

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But the question is, the quality of advice you get may not be the highest from ChatGPT, right?

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Well, it may not be, it may not be empathetic, that's right, and it certainly may not be able to go do things for you although with agents, who knows?

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But in terms of being able to pick up the phone and call somebody on my networker's behalf or my friend's behalf, ai is not going to do that yet, but there is.

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I believe, even more so now than there was before.

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Like, look, when we were online in the 2000s, when LinkedIn came out, facebook came out, you had a pretty good idea that there was a person behind every profile.

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Right, you're talking to a person.

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You know, I would say probably the 2010s, when people started realizing wait, these are bot accounts that are trying to spam, and some of the social networks and I would say a lot of them now are kind of infiltrated by that.

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But now we have even this.

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In some ways, it's almost a trick that you know, man, I really don't know if I'm talking to anybody on the other side.

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I really don't know if I'm talking to anybody on the other side.

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And it's getting to the point where, if you've seen the movie Her or if you look at what's happening with video, you're like my gosh, I'm not even sure, even if I get on video, if it's going to be a real person that I'm talking to.

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And so we have this time right now, where we're going to get faked out, and I think, even more so than before, there's going to be a craving for authenticity, right, the pendulum's swinging in one direction.

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You get AI-generated music, art, whatever, but people are having to define, well, what is art really?

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Is art something that's generated?

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Does it come from a human?

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Does it come from a person?

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Does it?

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Is art something that's generated?

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Does it come from a human?

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Does it come from a person?

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Does it come from AI?

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Does conversation, does it come from a human?

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Does it come from AI?

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And what does authenticity really mean?

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And that plays into a lot of areas, by the way, it plays into UX design, which is what my company does.

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How do you indicate that something is AI-gener, human generated?

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Do we have to tackle that at some point?

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So there's a lot there, but anyway, with community, I think that communities are going to become even more interesting and scrutinized and powerful if you can actually guarantee that there are people involved in them and not outsourced to just AI to go and achieve some marketing objective.

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Yeah, I guess what's real is the question going forward when so much is fake?

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The question is what is real?

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And I think that getting advice from people who are doing the thing that you want to do is the ideal thing from the front lines, if you will.

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If you will, I mean, ai is a great research buddy, but you still have to double, triple check everything it's telling you before you make any material decisions from it.

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So I think you know it's if you're talking to somebody who works in the tech area that you need advice on, for example, and they're in it every day and they're a person and you're talking they're a real person and you're talking to them in person at an event, for example, like I don't think you'd have to do necessarily the same level of sanity check.

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I probably still sanity check everything to get multiple sources for ideas, but you know it's still, I think, much more authentic on the spectrum, like you're saying.

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I think so too.

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I'll tell you.

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You know, when I was running Door64, every week I sent out a newsletter and I wrote it at night.

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I would write it on a Sunday night to send out on a Monday morning, and in the beginning I would include stories of my kids or what happened last week, or I'd be.

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You know, I can't help but be a bit humorous, especially if I'm, you know, an engineering humor, you know, and so I tend to be.

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You know, I try to write something clever.

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And then after a while I thought, you know, maybe it's becoming a professional community, maybe I should cut that out and I should just talk about what's coming up in the following week and so on.

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And I would attend my events.

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We would hold networking events in Austin for a few hundred people each, and folks would come over and say, hey, I'm kind of mad at you.

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And I thought, oh my gosh, what happened?

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And they said you stopped writing about your family, you stopped writing about the personal things.

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You just kind of made it businessy.

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And I realized at that point that this was not an initiative, this was a community in the real sense and people wanted to get to know me.

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And in fact, every newsletter I had my photo there so that when they came to an event they would at least know one person.

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It was all the willpower they could muster to get to an event and if they knew that I was going to be the one running it, then at least they'd be able to see my face and they'd have a friendly face right To go and meet and try to help them engage in the community.

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But the newsletter and that all of that kind of came together and it turned into a learning experience where the authenticity was joined at the hip with community and if it wasn't, then it wasn't really a community, right?

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If there wasn't that level of connection and authenticity, then it was just an initiative.

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It was something else.

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But that term community kept getting thrown around a lot.

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You know we have a community of this, community that, and I think that you know, linkedin is not a community, linkedin is just a platform, right, and they, many of these platforms, used to call themselves communities, and I think they were.

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It was disingenuous to do so because it there there wasn't anything in common with the people.

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There wasn't a reason to connect or talk.

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It was just, you know, like putting a bunch of people in the same room.

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That's not community, that's just an aggregation of people.

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Yeah, I think it's a community when people know, like and trust each other.

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I think that's what you're saying, right.

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That's right.

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That's right, and when they have some common, there are usually some commonalities between them.

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In Austin, it was people in high tech, people working in hardware, software, it but it was not for people that were coming there to solicit, right, it was not for financial planners or realtors or people like that.

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I would actually boot them out of my events because they'd try to get in, because they wanted to meet the people that could be their clients, right.

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So I would actively try to keep the group focused and, as I mentioned before, we had some common objectives that I thought you know.

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Over time, I started realizing and seeing that there are a lot of job postings about certain types of roles that nobody could.

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It seemed like these companies couldn't find the people they needed.

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It seemed like these companies couldn't find the people they needed, and so I ended up putting together an event in Austin where we had it was a very targeted job fair, focused on very certain roles that were hard to find, and we found that people were flying in from all over the US to come to that event because they knew it was worth their time over the US to come to that event.

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Because they knew it was worth their time and so that what I also learned about communities is that focus brought value.

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Sometimes people think that the numbers are going to grow and the numbers are going to make it all worthwhile, but if you don't have any focus for what you're trying to accomplish or the types of people that are there, then it's like what I said before it's just a bunch of people in the same room that don't necessarily have anything in common.

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And this job fair turned out to be very successful.

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We called it the pain point job fair because we were trying to address that pain point, and it really did make a difference.

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These companies were able to hire the people they needed, which I saw as being successful for the area right.

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It gave them the people they needed so they could grow and perhaps bring on other types of people as well that were in the area.

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Yeah, that's great.

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I think the power of focus really helps drive that connection between people, because if there's just a lot of people there that don't really meet, the bar of looks like them can be helpful to them and it's just vendors trying to sell people.

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That's sort of a yucky experience.

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What was the hardest thing about building the community Well, the hardest thing?

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I knew that I wanted to solve a problem right, and that problem was, I think, tech folks in the that.

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I tried this.

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I focused on the website.

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This was at the time when we didn't have online communities, like we didn't have Discord and stuff like this.

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Right, slack was just coming out, so there were some opportunities to use it, but I had to build something myself.

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So I built something like an engineer would and I made it pixel perfect.

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I made it beautiful and nobody came to my party.

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Right, I put everything there and it made it a real challenge because folks weren't coming to my events or coming to my online.

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You know, hangout time was that getting that online discussion was very difficult.

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It turns out if I solved other problems for people because I thought the discussion was going to help make people connected and help them to build relationships, and it would, but that happens better in person.

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What I found was easier was solving other problems for people like hey, here are some job postings that were published on our site from the past week.

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Here are some events coming up in the community relevant to tech that you may want to know about and that got the newsletter First of all.

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The newsletter started publicizing that.

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That got it forwarded out.

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People started really gravitating and coming onto the site.

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The discussions, the online discussions, were the very last thing and it was the very first thing I wanted and it was the very last thing to happen.

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Right and now that might've been because it was the time.

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It might be that just wasn't too much to talk about.

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But I'll tell you the events, the event, the in-person events.

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I found they blew up and they became really popular because people could come out and start meeting each other in person and building their own network in a way that they couldn't before, and so in the end, I was solving the problem.

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I just didn't solve it in a way that I originally thought I was going to.

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I ended up solving it a different way, but I had to bob and weave and figure it out along the way.

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Yeah, I think in-person events still sort of probably have that magic for different reasons today.

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Like, probably one of the reasons you mentioned is online, like on LinkedIn, there's 120 million fake accounts they deleted just this year.

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Like I can't even wrap my head around that stat of like it's not really a community, it's like a bot community if it's anything, and so you know, that's, I think, a very weird experience for people.

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Even when people, I think, go into Reddit since they've gone public is more popular for sort of these subreddits or communities, and I think some of them get kind of interesting, but a lot of them are just sort of full of weird stuff, and so I've heard a lot of feedback from people saying they still really get a lot of value from the in-person events.

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I think it's good to research things online, use AI, but I think people still are going to conferences and networking events and things like this to try to get high quality, authentic insights, like you were saying.

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That's exactly right.

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I tend to think the same, eric, that in-person events and conferences are probably not going to go away, because we still are going to crave that in person.

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We want to be able to shake somebody's hand right, talk with them, get the full communication right From them with the face, the hands, the everything right, the voice right.

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Have that some kind of full communication with them.

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And conferences I mean you can do that on Zoom and we're doing that right here, but on you know, when you go to a conference, you can do that at scale, and it's hard to do that at scale, uh, unless you're hosting a webinar or a podcast sometimes.

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But to go and meet other people and, by the way, also to get the kind of get the zeitgeist of where things are at you it still is has the South by Southwest conference and I love to just go walk around the floor and kind of just spend a day seeing what people are working on.

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It gives you an idea of what the lay of the land is or the state of the union looks like for a certain area or technology or something like that.

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It's hard to do that if you're not physically there at the conference, everybody kind of hanging out their shingle and showing what they're working on.

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You know they're useful in that regard, so I don't know that they're going to go away anytime soon.

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I think it's still a very powerful way for people to connect.

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You can't really enjoy a coffee with AI.

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You can drink your own coffee, but it's not really the same as enjoying a cup of coffee with someone else and having a good conversation.

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So it's just sort of a different thing.

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Any other advice you could give to people who are looking to create their own community?

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actually, at Planarama, we have a strong component of our work that involves AI, and we started on this early, very early, actually doing work on AI and systems that are using AI and designing for those systems, so we've kind of got our feet wet in that area.

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So what we did is we built an online community.

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We started one a couple about a year and a half ago called AI Product Hive, and it's for product teams, people from product teams, product managers, designers, developers, qa to come on and to meet other people that are doing the same kind of things that they are, especially when they're working on projects or products that involve generative AI, and to share stories, to share what's working, share what's not, and that can still be very valuable right, those online communities are quite useful and people are going on there and using it every day.

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I think we still have the need to have face-to-face connections Now on an online community, that can be a challenge.

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What we do is we hold bi-weekly calls where we have a topic or we have somebody presenting about what they're working on, and we have everybody join and we post those on YouTube and that's a way for people to have some level of authenticity about who this is and who the people are behind it, and having that connection and sometimes making the connections that are going to go outside of the community and turn into friendships or turn into new projects or ventures or whatever that is.

00:22:35.309 --> 00:22:42.625
So I think communities are still very relevant and going to start them is actually much easier than it was before.

00:22:42.724 --> 00:22:55.047
I had to build something, you know, build a site, back in 2006 to go and do this, but now you've got things like Discord and Slack and many others that are available.

00:22:55.047 --> 00:23:03.934
That well, you know, almost within about half a day you can be set up, you know, and get everything the way you want it.

00:23:03.934 --> 00:23:07.896
But then being involved with it and nurturing it, that's a different story, right?

00:23:07.896 --> 00:23:23.224
So there are people that do this, you know, community managers and people that grow it, and I have a wonderful one that works with me and he's in that all the time, helping people to feel welcome in the community and doing a fantastic job, and so that's it's an ongoing effort.

00:23:23.224 --> 00:23:34.156
But, look, I know that we're able to do good things with it and we can create kind of these win-win scenarios with people in the community meeting each other and also getting to know about Planarama as well.

00:23:34.156 --> 00:23:38.250
We don't make it a hard sell about what we do at Planarama, but people know that we're there.

00:23:38.250 --> 00:23:43.209
But, more importantly, we get to see folks thrive and that's exciting.

00:23:44.692 --> 00:23:45.113
That's great.

00:23:45.113 --> 00:23:55.728
I will link to that in the show notes so people who are a good fit for that can check it out and really appreciate you being with us today and sharing your stories and your insights.

00:23:55.728 --> 00:23:56.609
Thanks for being on the show.

00:23:57.171 --> 00:23:57.752
Thank you, Eric.

00:23:57.752 --> 00:23:58.374
I had a great time.

00:23:58.374 --> 00:24:02.510
It was really nice to take this little bit of a trip down memory lane for me on the community side.

00:24:02.510 --> 00:24:03.102
I've been doing this for